Hello from me.

[aljaxon]

ive just tried to learn to play the guitar in earnest this last year after being a 3 chord only strummer for the last 40 odd years. i am finding it very hard to learn picking as my brain is very slow at remembering things. its taken me months to learn stuff like the picking on elton johns love song and going from an a minor  to a cadd9 on dust in the wind takes an age cos my little finger wont do what i want it to. i am a fantastic singer but have zero range.  ive been jamming with a friend  fortnightly and he hates me cos he learns to play a song but in order for me to play it  i transpose it to suit my voice or to play easier chords and use a capo. so then he has to relearn it.  we are thinking of doing an open mic session at a pub soon.  he was in a band for a time. ive only flirted with it as a teenager. ive never taken any lessons, my grandson aged 10 is and im watching his development. i use youtube guitar lessons all the time how to play songs but my technique is very poor. and my biggest battle is not getting too frustrated that i put the guitar down. my neighbours hate me cos i play and sing along a lot and we have thin walls. i joined this forum because i need help with a technical issue on my accoustic.

im a builder in my early sixties, i have small fat stubby fingers that deaden adjacent strings. i might make some false finger ends unless you can buy them. im into tinkering with old classic mopeds and have a few other bigger motorcycles.

im unhappily married and have 2 kids and 2 grankids both to my daughter.  i own my own house, own a van but im  pretty much skint.

i hope thats enough of an introduction.

hello everyone.

 

 

 

[randythoades]

Hello and welcome.

Plenty here to learn from and chuckle at.

 

Frustration and patience are your biggest hurdles by the sound of it. You Tube is great, but no replacement for a proper teacher and I would heartily recommend visiting one, even just for a few months to even out your technique. I would also counsel against changing the songs to make them easier, if you only play the stuff you can already play you never progress. Changing them to fit your voice is one thing, but trying to avoid chords just because isn't doing you any favours long term.

But also, don't get too hung up on playing them exactly as the records, most of us here can't play everything and do simplify songs to a degree. At the end of the day... just enjoy the journey!

[Dad3353]

Good afternoon, @aljaxon, and ...

 

 

... Plenty to read and amuse you here, and lots to learn and share. 

[ezbass]

[aljaxon]

On 13/11/2024 at 12:45, randythoades said:

Hello and welcome.

Plenty here to learn from and chuckle at.

 

Frustration and patience are your biggest hurdles by the sound of it. You Tube is great, but no replacement for a proper teacher and I would heartily recommend visiting one, even just for a few months to even out your technique. I would also counsel against changing the songs to make them easier, if you only play the stuff you can already play you never progress. Changing them to fit your voice is one thing, but trying to avoid chords just because isn't doing you any favours long term.

But also, don't get too hung up on playing them exactly as the records, most of us here can't play everything and do simplify songs to a degree. At the end of the day... just enjoy the journey!

i think some songs are played on electric guitar with barre chords where it doesnt matter at all if there are f# bflat etc. but on an accoustic these chords sound terrible.    so i transpose them to open easier chords it sounds much better.  you must agree on an accoustic open chords are a million times better than barre?  i forgot to mention ive got accoustic guitars only. 

as for simplifying you are preaching to the converted!!!   and at 63 ive come to the conclusion im not going to be a brilliant guitarist, havent got enough time left on this planet.  i need every trick in the book to help me. so ive given up on trying to get barre chords sounding as good on an accoustic as open chords and  instead devote my practicing hours to learning other stuff.

 

  but thanks for the advice!!  

[Dad3353]

It's an 'open secret' (one that so many people know, that they don't think it worth mentioning, so, to the non-initiated, it remains a secret..!) that, when playing guitar, one doesn't have to play all the strings, all the time, for all the chords. It's useful to practice, and so learn, only playing the strings that actually make up the chord (often only three or four...), and skip, or mute, the strings not needed. This applies to both open and barre chords, and even more so for 'movable' chords (where one may play them anywhere on the neck...). If a barre chord proves to be difficult, practice playing it further up the neck, where the first-finger barre may be easier, and gradually, every other day, move down towards the nut. The fingers will become more accustomed, and the barre easier. When barring a chord, try to get the sound right on only the top four strings, for instance, if the barre is difficult to manage right the way across. Then try again, but getting the bottom four strings to sound right (so not playing the top two...). You may also play without a barre at all if you play only the middle four strings (so not the top or bottom 'E' strings...), and compose the chord with the four fingers, without a barre at all.
If these notions find resonance with you, I could compose a chord chart showing many ways of playing chords, with no barre, anywhere on the neck. Why does this matter..? Well, one reason is to be able to change chords easily by going across the neck, instead of up and down, making chord changes much smoother (and less tiring...).
What songs or tunes do you presently play, and what songs or tunes would you like to play..? Any particular style, or guitarist, group or era..? It would help us to give more pertinent advice.
Hope this helps. 

Douglas

[randythoades]

10 hours ago, aljaxon said:

i think some songs are played on electric guitar with barre chords where it doesnt matter at all if there are f# bflat etc. but on an accoustic these chords sound terrible.    so i transpose them to open easier chords it sounds much better.  you must agree on an accoustic open chords are a million times better than barre?  i forgot to mention ive got accoustic guitars only. 

as for simplifying you are preaching to the converted!!!   and at 63 ive come to the conclusion im not going to be a brilliant guitarist, havent got enough time left on this planet.  i need every trick in the book to help me. so ive given up on trying to get barre chords sounding as good on an accoustic as open chords and  instead devote my practicing hours to learning other stuff.

 

  but thanks for the advice!!  

I respectively disagree about barre chords. I much prefer them to open chords. As @Dad3353 points out, you don't have to play all the strings. I don't like the way that the open strings sometimes resonate longer than the fretted strings when I change chords, but I can cut off or mute the whole sound whenever I like with a barre chord, especially on acoustic to add a percussive element.

And all I am saying about simplifying is that whilst most players do simplify to a degree, you effectively restrict your guitar technique and vocabulary by avoiding chords or techniques you can't yet do and will not improve.

[aljaxon]

2 hours ago, randythoades said:

I respectively disagree about barre chords. I much prefer them to open chords. As @Dad3353 points out, you don't have to play all the strings. I don't like the way that the open strings sometimes resonate longer than the fretted strings when I change chords, but I can cut off or mute the whole sound whenever I like with a barre chord, especially on acoustic to add a percussive element.

And all I am saying about simplifying is that whilst most players do simplify to a degree, you effectively restrict your guitar technique and vocabulary by avoiding chords or techniques you can't yet do and will not improve.

you have to remember we are talking about me here and the sound i'm creating. barre chords sound rubbish. open chords sound fantastic in comparison.  so i use them. i dont care about whether i should be learning to play barre chords.  virtually every song i play sounds great with open chords and a capo. i am intrigued by only using 3 fingers and leaving the rest open. like the intro 2 chords to breads make it with you which when i play sounds great until i ruin it with the 2 barre chords

[aljaxon]

On 14/11/2024 at 22:34, Dad3353 said:

It's an 'open secret' (one that so many people know, that they don't think it worth mentioning, so, to the non-initiated, it remains a secret..!) that, when playing guitar, one doesn't have to play all the strings, all the time, for all the chords. It's useful to practice, and so learn, only playing the strings that actually make up the chord (often only three or four...), and skip, or mute, the strings not needed. This applies to both open and barre chords, and even more so for 'movable' chords (where one may play them anywhere on the neck...). If a barre chord proves to be difficult, practice playing it further up the neck, where the first-finger barre may be easier, and gradually, every other day, move down towards the nut. The fingers will become more accustomed, and the barre easier. When barring a chord, try to get the sound right on only the top four strings, for instance, if the barre is difficult to manage right the way across. Then try again, but getting the bottom four strings to sound right (so not playing the top two...). You may also play without a barre at all if you play only the middle four strings (so not the top or bottom 'E' strings...), and compose the chord with the four fingers, without a barre at all.
If these notions find resonance with you, I could compose a chord chart showing many ways of playing chords, with no barre, anywhere on the neck. Why does this matter..? Well, one reason is to be able to change chords easily by going across the neck, instead of up and down, making chord changes much smoother (and less tiring...).
What songs or tunes do you presently play, and what songs or tunes would you like to play..? Any particular style, or guitarist, group or era..? It would help us to give more pertinent advice.
Hope this helps. 

Douglas

thanks for taking the time to reply. the songs i currently play all with open chords are candy paulo nutini your ghost kristen hirsh  wonderwall, stop crying your heart out, stand by me, all oasis, chance big country, never tear us apart mistify inxs long and winding road, rain, ticket to ride, strawberry fields, across the universe beatles , tomorrow, born of frustration james, closer kings of leon, fake plastic trees radiohead  fix you, a message coldplay every one of us rick astley, impossible james arthur  sonnet, verve, they dont own m,e richard ashcroft, wish you were here, pink floyd  killoing moon echo and the bunnymen   all for you cian ducrot - high pitched leprechaun transposed to  lee marvin. hate to see you cry alan hull. most of calum scotts non dancy stuff.  back for good take that,   holding back the years simply red davig grey babylon oldies like cant explain cant get enough of your love sunny afternoon and even tried the new post malone country and western stuff. loads more.  and for the finger picking i practice soldiers eyes jack savoretti  dust in the wind kansas  love song elton john which ive mastered and now trying to sing in time to it. started solsbury hill. got the first bar under my belt!!!   and every day if i hear a song i write it down and try to do a version.

 

i have a problem with memory so use ultimate guitar for their chords and lyrics plus the fantastic transpose. there are maybe 2 or 3 songs pout of all that lot that i can sing in the same key as the original. well i can sing all of them in key but only like a choir boy. to give it power and raspiness i have to transpose them all down.

 

ive seen people do triads? is that almost the same thing as what you are suggesting? 3 or 4 finger chords up and down the neck?

 

Edited November 16 by aljaxon
spelling

[ezbass]

If you're happy not playing barre chords, then that's fine. However, it will impede your progress. It's not all E/Em and A/Am shapes (dominant & minor 7ths too), a barred C shape is a great voicing to have available, for instance. It takes time and effort to build up the strength to play barre chords, but once you have it down, you'll never look back. Just to reiterate, you don't need to voice all 6 strings when playing chords, you often must (see should) mute some of the notes so as not give the wrong flavour to your playing.

[Dad3353]

1 hour ago, aljaxon said:

...ive seen people do triads? is that almost the same thing as what you are suggesting? 3 or 4 finger chords up and down the neck?

 

Yes, 'triads' is a way of constructing chords, and is extremely useful. You already have a song repertoire far, far in excess of anything I've ever played in over half a century (disclaimer : I'm a drummer...), so 'Well done; you're doing something right..!'

Can I recommend 'Guitar Pro 8'..? For the next couple of weeks it's at a reduced price of under £50, and is well worth it, in my opinion. As well as chord shape suggestions, it enables easy transposition and there are a wealth of songs in 'gp' format. Worth trying, maybe..? 

[aljaxon]

 

On 15/11/2024 at 11:31, ezbass said:

If you're happy not playing barre chords, then that's fine. However, it will impede your progress. It's not all E/Em and A/Am shapes (dominant & minor 7ths too), a barred C shape is a great voicing to have available, for instance. It takes time and effort to build up the strength to play barre chords, but once you have it down, you'll never look back. Just to reiterate, you don't need to voice all 6 strings when playing chords, you often must (see should) mute some of the notes so as not give the wrong flavour to your playing.

 i dont have enough time to learn everything about playing the guitar. theres loads i am  not  going to try and learn unless it naturally falls into place as my technique improves and a song needs it. but so far like i say theres only 2 songs out of about 50 that cant be played with what i call open chords. im currently trying to get my fingers to do what i want them to do. eg going from  an Am to a Cadd9 my little finger is very slow to move. and on sunflower the little intro was hard a week ago  but now its almost easy if i leave out one note on the last bit.

 

i practicing picking quietly even while watching tv. sometimes up to 2 hours a day. i can definitely see improvements. even over the last week.    my approach has been -  hear a song. think yeah lets try and play along to that and then learn to do so as accurately as possible.    its been a lot of fun so far.  im finding out my weaknesses and ive been trying to improve on them. not just sticking to the same open chords that ive done since the 1970's. when practicing  i focus on what i cant play, instead of what i can play.   when im jamming with a pal or singing to myself or missus (or neighbours through the walls) thats when i stick to playing to what i can play. im popping round to a long time pals this evening first time for a jam. is that the word?   could be interesting.  i think im going to surprise myself at how crap i really am lol and might see what other areas i need to brush up on.

 

[aljaxon]

On 15/11/2024 at 13:17, Dad3353 said:

 

Yes, 'triads' is a way of constructing chords, and is extremely useful. You already have a song repertoire far, far in excess of anything I've ever played in over half a century (disclaimer : I'm a drummer...), so 'Well done; you're doing something right..!'

Can I recommend 'Guitar Pro 8'..? For the next couple of weeks it's at a reduced price of under £50, and is well worth it, in my opinion. As well as chord shape suggestions, it enables easy transposition and there are a wealth of songs in 'gp' format. Worth trying, maybe..? 

dad ive always been a tight git.  i just go on ultimate guitar its free. plus ive just started learning to use fl studio which was given to me for nowt so i can make my own drum beats and backing stuff.   dunno if you need to have a face book account to wacth this  but here is a very short clip of my doing my best Ian mcCulloch impersonation. i was only going to put the chorus bit in and was virtually mouthing the lead up lines but decided to leave them in.  ive watched youtube clips of echo and the bunnymen live and i can safely say i "p1ss" all over what he can do nowadays on the high notes. he needs to go on ultimate guitar and transpose it down a bit lol. 

 

https://www.facebook.com/alan.jackson.7731/videos/2532299470293234